tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post7670784292433599224..comments2023-05-14T21:11:23.699-04:00Comments on CHEESEBURGER BROWN: Story Wallah: The Secret Mathematic - Chapter Twenty-NineCheeseburger Brownhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01384136287767500794noreply@blogger.comBlogger28125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-54620587584233493212008-08-26T09:03:00.000-04:002008-08-26T09:03:00.000-04:00Dear pso,I can appreciate your point.All I can say...Dear pso,<BR/><BR/>I can appreciate your point.<BR/><BR/>All I can say is that I do think some of your concerns may be allayed (or at least reduced somewhat) by the way I'll be tying Drago's hospital lessons into his research in Chapter 31.<BR/><BR/>Bear with me.<BR/><BR/>Love,<BR/>Cheeseburger BrownCheeseburger Brownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01384136287767500794noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-31613980383202261202008-08-25T16:27:00.000-04:002008-08-25T16:27:00.000-04:00Kinda late to leave a comment here, now that the n...Kinda late to leave a comment here, now that the next chapter has already been posted, but what the heck.<BR/><BR/>This was a very thrilling chapter, and the first response I wanted to post after finishing it was: "Magnificient! Bravo!".<BR/><BR/>The one thing I did not like though, was the hyper sensory powers that Drago seems to acquire. I've seen this in a few stories before, and it always irks me. The protagonist realises that everything in the world is connected to everything else, and therefore minutely examining any small detail of the world can reveal unlimited information about everything else. Or, as Douglas Adams put it, "...since every piece of matter in the Universe is in someway affected by every other piece of matter in the Universe, it is in theory possible to extrapolate the whole of creation - every Galaxy, every sun, every planet, their orbits, their composition, and their economic and social history from, say, one small piece of fairy cake."<BR/><BR/>This kind of thing always irks me (unless used for comedic purposes, like in the Hitchhiker's Guide) because (1) our sensory powers are limited, and imagining that that instruments, let along people, can measure anything to that accuracy is not believable, and (2) because everything affects everything else, it is not believable that extracting one of those small effects would be possible.<BR/><BR/>Drago seemed to acquire some such sensory superpowers in this chapter, which was disappointing. I've been very happy with the descriptions of his research so far - the description of slow, painstaking, methodical work has been surprisingly realistic (compare with hollowood descriptions of science where everything is always very dramatic, and a good idea can be fully realised with just a few days of work).<BR/><BR/>-paramAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-56062735160703143802008-08-24T13:27:00.000-04:002008-08-24T13:27:00.000-04:00I'm guessing Anwar was planning on doing the ol' s...I'm guessing Anwar was planning on doing the ol' swicheroo -- break out the real Drago and leave the Doppelgänger in his place in the nuthouse. They were just not planning on the others moving in at the same time.EMHMark3https://www.blogger.com/profile/08215789780507400127noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-6027493957883132412008-08-23T22:29:00.000-04:002008-08-23T22:29:00.000-04:00The Equivalency is still thousands of years in the...The Equivalency is still thousands of years in the future. As for TSM, they don't have it; remember, they're waiting for Drago to get it so they can steal it. Remember what the blue pants people said to Drago on Rue des Ecoles? <I>"Note the fields that circulate through simple machines. Temper the fields to touch the works, and nudge them. Repeat to cognition."</I><BR/><BR/>Just standard psycho-EM manipulation, that's all.<BR/><BR/>Re. hysterical aphasia, I actually work with a guy who had this from a head injury. He spent six weeks learning to use adverbs again, and then got really mad because he found out that nobody uses them anymore.<BR/><BR/>Some questions:<BR/><BR/>Why -- and how -- would Zenobio wear a medallion on his back?<BR/><BR/>What is the purpose of the faux Drago? Is it merely to die in the fray and lay a trail of misdirection? If so, how effective could it be, since one or both parties would certainly have lookouts outside and thereby notice the switch?<BR/><BR/>Then again, maybe Anwar took out the stragglers.<BR/><BR/>Either way, there's so much humor, adventure, and mayhem in this chapter that it's almost impossible to keep track of the typos. Maybe later after a third read...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-61027837574762487732008-08-23T18:37:00.000-04:002008-08-23T18:37:00.000-04:00Rockin', as ever. The bits about knitting (&am...Rockin', as ever. The bits about knitting (& posessive yarnaholics) are particularly nice.Reetay Ononlayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07580763866232985090noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-91943801589477524462008-08-23T03:30:00.000-04:002008-08-23T03:30:00.000-04:00art is exported awe! i was delighted to see the ro...art is exported awe! i was delighted to see the room-loom from "what art is" show up in this chapter.<BR/><BR/>also, "aggressive reiki": ha!gl.https://www.blogger.com/profile/11890196589573443189noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-4109716110148617062008-08-22T03:12:00.000-04:002008-08-22T03:12:00.000-04:00Hmm... I'd sayl with equation... algorithm seems m...Hmm... I'd sayl with equation... algorithm seems more iterative, whereas I'm guessing TSM is all about having nice closed-form solutions... strong resonances, rather than crappy power series expansions and the like... :)<BR/>You might use 'manifold' or 'curvature', since it's describing a geometry... but Drago has other people that deal with mathematical terms for what he does, right? so maybe "equation" is what he can do... generally saying an equation describes a surface is pretty normal... heh... crappy pun not intended.<BR/><BR/>It seemed to me that Drago doesn't trust Prioska... or for that matter, anybody but Felix. I guess he knows that Felix knows that nothing's going to get anywhere without him.<BR/><BR/>It wasn't clear to me that the Hubbardians were using non-TSM, non-Equivalence either. It seemed to me that they were working some kind of magic, not physically contacting their enemy combatant... even with martial arts, unless it's Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon stuff... There's something mystical the Hubbardian is doing to get the orderly to become distracted... as far as I can tell in this paragraph... a few finger twitches suggested it was TSM or Equivalence to me.<BR/><BR/><BR/><BR/>Here's the paragraph:<BR/>The cadre, however, does not slacken its pace. The first among them simply strides unswervingly toward the orderly, pointing at him with an extended index finger. The finger sways left, and so do the orderly's eyes; the finger sways right and again the motion is tracked. The extended finger circles and swoops in a complex pattern and then is jabbed high in a sudden thrust. The orderly's eyes roll up into the back of his head, giving his assailant the split second he needs to walk right up to him, executing a rapid series of precise taps on the orderly's chest that culminates in a seemingly gentle poke in the solar plexus.fooburgerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00598732577922981025noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-52619162569943092002008-08-22T00:04:00.000-04:002008-08-22T00:04:00.000-04:00"Zenobio takes to carrying loops of the trailing e..."Zenobio takes to carrying loops of the trailing edge of the scarf, so that when Drago enters the dining hall he looks like a bizarre, stubbled bride with a bouquet of needles."<BR/><BR/>This chapter was wonderfully entertaining, and that excerpt above was a brilliant piece of writing. It was a Tic-Tac moment to beat all others.Markhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08722639974320971726noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-86662370812438959932008-08-21T23:19:00.000-04:002008-08-21T23:19:00.000-04:00Amazing... just amazing. I try to excitedly tel...Amazing... just amazing. I try to excitedly tell my wife about this chapter and what CBB has done.. she thinks I'm crazy.Jeff S.https://www.blogger.com/profile/02764196315045454317noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-54328383003306144462008-08-21T18:20:00.000-04:002008-08-21T18:20:00.000-04:00I got so exited reading this chapter, my coworkers...I got so exited reading this chapter, my coworkers probably think I'm looking at porn...Well it is geek porn.Big thttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03728437300843445339noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-10156671797604069672008-08-21T13:24:00.000-04:002008-08-21T13:24:00.000-04:00My extra very favorite new quote; "Not everything ...My extra very favorite new quote; "Not everything can be solved with finesse," explains Zenobio. "Sometimes you've just got to smack the living shit out of it."<BR/><BR/>Chapter 30 released tomorrow?<BR/><BR/>THE DanimalDanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01657614872089173887noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-43369434595799183472008-08-21T11:44:00.000-04:002008-08-21T11:44:00.000-04:00In my opinion, this may be the best chapter you've...In my opinion, this may be the best chapter you've ever written to any of your stories CBB.<BR/><BR/>There is too much goodness to point it all out, but some of my favorite aspects are...<BR/><BR/>I like how you slowed down the pace at the beginning of this chapter. It gives the reader a chance to "rest" after the excitement of the previous Mr. Miss chapters. <BR/><BR/>I also like how Drago's personality and speech patterns changed based on his medication and who he was talking to. At first, when he was talking to the doctor, I thought it was odd that he spoke English so well, but then later, when we find out he is "acting", it makes perfect sense. <BR/><BR/>I laughed out loud at <I>"It's the Jews!"..."Run!"</I> and <I>"Stop, in the name of Hubbard!"</I><BR/><BR/>I also loved watching Drago get his intellect back as the meds wore off.<BR/><BR/>I'd stick with "algorithm". It feels more accurate.Erichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05571302657092617699noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-29593630315849704052008-08-21T10:11:00.000-04:002008-08-21T10:11:00.000-04:00Picking the collective brain: should "equations" b...Picking the collective brain: should "equations" be substituted for "algorithm" in the passage about spaghetti and meatballs?<BR/><BR/>CodeWright asked,<BR/><BR/><I>Were the Hubbardians using Equivalent Math? Or just some weird jujutsu?</I><BR/><BR/>Mr. Miss has implied that the Hubbardians make masterful use of various kinds of hypnosis, misdirection and suggestion. In this chapter I'm also suggesting that they have a knowledge of the nervous system comparable to a kung fu sensei -- pressure points, critical ganglia, aggressive <A HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reiki" REL="nofollow">reiki</A> or whatnot.<BR/><BR/>Simon: <I>prekid borbeni mene</I> is a translation (of uncertain fidelity) for "stop fighting me."<BR/><BR/>Simon also said,<BR/><BR/><I>If I recall correctly, this is the second time something like it has appeared in a CBB yarn...</I><BR/><BR/>As far as I know, this is the first instance of webby madness in the fiction realm. I wrote previously about <I>two</I> web incidents <A HREF="http://cheeseburgerbrown.com/articles/What_Art_Is.html" REL="nofollow">here</A>. This includes the art project in college known as NAUGHTY LOOM plus the time when I was five and I strung up my basement as a makeshift <A HREF="http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6TJ8-4KXDR6K-1&_user=10&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=93277051e58d812530eb8db463a90920" REL="nofollow">spacelike hypersurface</A> after being excited by the opening title sequence from the movie <I>The Black Hole</I>.<BR/><BR/>fooburger warned,<BR/><BR/><I>Actually... the need for tension release is quite great at this point... it might be different in book-at-once format, but yer obviously aware of the potential perils of drawing out the mysteries toooo far.. :)</I><BR/><BR/>Oh yeah? I haven't told you the worst part yet: one of the principals in TSM is actually a frakking Cylon!<BR/><BR/>Dear Kevin,<BR/><BR/>I do your point here. Zenobio rode the line uncomfortably between having a thematically relevant symptom, and being comic relief. I could've probably spent more time sussing that balance out.<BR/><BR/>Some aphasias, however, can be <I>really</I> weird. My step-father works (and my wife has worked) with brain injured individuals, and I've sure heard some strange stories. In this case, the cause of psychiatric instead of physical damage. We're never told what other problems Zenobio has (since nobody gets shut up in an institution for merely stuttering), but in my experience it is not a long shot to imagine that part of Zenobio's problem is not just that he can't remember words, but that he becomes obsessive over their retrieval. One must remember that Zenobio, like Drago, is doped up on meds -- we can only imagine how his condition might cause him to behave otherwise.<BR/><BR/>Gotta work.<BR/><BR/>Love,<BR/>Cheeseburger BrownCheeseburger Brownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01384136287767500794noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-86218632312971794962008-08-21T09:59:00.000-04:002008-08-21T09:59:00.000-04:00This chapter reminded me of the idea that a name i...This chapter reminded me of the idea that a name is a way of controlling something, from lots of old magic theories. Always a fun thought process to explain why it works, and this is one of the first that I actually believe. I really enjoyed him opening the door with sonic vibrations, very Doctor Who.<BR/><BR/>TRHTeddyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06429915965397673079noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-58765044815842423142008-08-21T09:33:00.000-04:002008-08-21T09:33:00.000-04:00saintpeter wrote:I don't think the mind is actuall...saintpeter wrote:<BR/><I>I don't think the mind is actually "Holographic". There are many clear cases of specific structural damage to the brain removing very specific portions of ability.</I><BR/><BR/>I'm not claiming the mind can be represented using the hologram as a total model, but I do believe it is holographic in nature (or at least in parts). This is a wonderfully complex field, and my studies in this area continually amaze me.<BR/><BR/>Notwithstanding, my original comments were merely present to point out the small issue that jarred me throughout the chapter concerning Zenobio's behavior. The depiction of words that Zenobio couldn't remember, when juxtaposed with words he obviously had no trouble using in context to describe the word he couldn't remember just seemed a little strained to me.<BR/><BR/>Here's an example: When Drago and Zenobio are discussing the words that Zenobio observed in the scarf that Drago is knitting, he has trouble remembering the word "snow". But when we are first introduced to Zenobio, he specifically uses the phrase "Snow-capped peaks" in describing a mountain.<BR/><BR/>In addition, I myself suffer, in a more limited sense, from a similar problem to the one attributed to Zenobio. His attempt to remember the word "snow" by saying:<BR/><BR/><I>...you know, water that isn't wet? What do you call it?"<BR/><BR/>...<BR/><BR/>"It's not hard or soft, but it can be both, and it never falls in summer, and you need it for certain sports, and I can't think about winter properly without knowing the name of that stuff."<BR/></I><BR/><BR/>It just seemed a little over the top to me. In my personal experience, I would have left it at "that stuff that falls in winter", 'cause even if I couldn't remember the word, I <B>do</B> know that that would have been enough for just about anyone else around me to realize exactly what I was talking about.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-47974407343419124142008-08-21T06:27:00.000-04:002008-08-21T06:27:00.000-04:00Wow you have so many people hobbling in your stori...Wow you have so many people hobbling in your stories that I really had no idea what was going on till I remembered The Plight of the Transformer.<BR/><BR/>At first I thought it would be Lalo, then Sky then when you said it was Drago it took me a full minute till I remembered The Transformer!<BR/><BR/>Excellent chapter!!alhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12330912850864917649noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-20293769813231671892008-08-21T03:04:00.000-04:002008-08-21T03:04:00.000-04:00Personally, I thought Zenobio was a little tedious...Personally, I thought Zenobio was a little tedious in the chapter. Part way through I was thinking to myself: "I get it.. he has a tough time finding the word"<BR/>I liked the connection of his handicap to TSM, but maybe drop one of the instantiations of the problem?<BR/>Maybe it really needs to be that high profile to make sure the connection is clear... Maybe it took me too long to get it? I dunno.<BR/><BR/>Anyways.. I liked this chapter a lot... I'm really wanting to know for certain who's good and bad... and which side Lallo and Jeremiah chime in on... we've all got our theories... most better than mine. :)<BR/><BR/>Actually... the need for tension release is quite great at this point... it might be different in book-at-once format, but yer obviously aware of the potential perils of drawing out the mysteries toooo far.. :)fooburgerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00598732577922981025noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-34662874951105955282008-08-21T00:31:00.000-04:002008-08-21T00:31:00.000-04:00In the last Drago chapter, I was disappointed when...In the last Drago chapter, I was disappointed when things moved from orange and green to getting tossed into the loony bin, but I turned out to really enjoy the loony bin chapter after all...<BR/><BR/>btw, when you use the pattern "'[blah blah]', claims [somebody]", "claims" tends to pull me back out of the events and remind me that I'm reading for some reason.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-12133122765726702132008-08-20T21:04:00.000-04:002008-08-20T21:04:00.000-04:00Kevin wrote:it's hard to believe that he would hav...Kevin wrote:<BR/><I>it's hard to believe that he would have trouble remembering certain words, but would be able to eloquently and precisely define the word. It just didn't ring true to me.</I><BR/><BR/>The mind is a funny thing. <A HREF="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aphasia" REL="nofollow">Aphasia</A> is a real disorder, although it is typically caused by structural damage to the brain. "Hysterical Aphasia" might be brought on by stress or emotional trama. I was unable to find a reference for it online, but it seems real enough for me.<BR/><BR/>Aphasia and it's variants are pretty weird. Patients lose the connection between the word they mean and the word they actually say say. In some cases they have to completely relearn to speak. In other cases they cannot read or write. Some Aphasics can sing perfectly fine, but cannot talk.<BR/><BR/>I don't think the mind is actually "Holographic". There are many clear cases of specific structural damage to the brain removing very specific portions of ability. These cases are actually very illuminating, because they demonstrate that some functions we presume are controlled together, are actually separate. Now, the brain is amazingly FLEXIBLE, and there are many documented cases of specific structures being destroyed, but their functionality being moved to another portion of the brain. That's not holographic, per se, but it is pretty neat.SaintPeterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02064605142705446251noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-36493349678066068692008-08-20T19:43:00.000-04:002008-08-20T19:43:00.000-04:00I like itI like itTolomeahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16384928311920896699noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-8473559471924382912008-08-20T18:57:00.000-04:002008-08-20T18:57:00.000-04:00Hubbardians vs. Ninjews. Wow. I think the stay i...Hubbardians vs. Ninjews. Wow. I think the stay in the hospital helped Drago more than his doctor's did.bilhelm96https://www.blogger.com/profile/15498973297025243828noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-48087118251691075412008-08-20T18:44:00.000-04:002008-08-20T18:44:00.000-04:00OH yeah.I am truly amazed at the amount of awesome...OH yeah.<BR/><BR/>I am truly amazed at the amount of awesome you've crammed into this one chapter.<BR/><BR/>No time for deconstruction, but that was a heck of a fun ride.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-55697218628223478452008-08-20T18:08:00.000-04:002008-08-20T18:08:00.000-04:00Just needed a second comment to ensure the rest ar...Just needed a second comment to ensure the rest are emailed to me. <BR/><BR/>Stupid Blogger.Simonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06946639624660520997noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-59445023563124860102008-08-20T18:07:00.000-04:002008-08-20T18:07:00.000-04:00I tried to find a translation for "prekid borbeni ...I tried to find a translation for "prekid borbeni mene", but the couple Serbian-English translators I found online didn't turn anything up. I can only assume it means roughly the same as the previous phrase in the scarf.<BR/><BR/>I love Drago chapters nearly as much as the Mr. Miss chapters. I certainly wasn't disappointed with his scientific soliloquy to Zenobio regarding names and sets and dimensions. Very tantalizing. <BR/><BR/>When he pulled the scarf apart to make the ad hoc harp, I felt like it was the Naughty Loom all over again. If I recall correctly, this is the second time something like it has appeared in a CBB yarn, but I can't for the life of me recall the first (alleged, by me) appearance. Hmmm...<BR/><BR/>One thing I noticed about the language (and maybe it's just me, I don't know), but it seems that Drago talked less like Drago while he was on the pills, and more like himself after he got off. Don't know if that was intentional, but it was a nice touch if so.<BR/><BR/>I saw a couple minor spelling and punctuation mistakes, but didn't jot them down as I was reading along my print-out.<BR/><BR/>This IS the first confirmation that the followers in blue pants are the Hubbardians, right? Suspicion and speculation before, but I think this is the first time we KNOW it's them. I still have no idea who to trust, though I'm more inclined toward the nin-Jews than the Hubbardians, fer shure.<BR/><BR/>Holy excitement, Batman!Simonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06946639624660520997noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-16435271.post-65178862718686193962008-08-20T17:56:00.000-04:002008-08-20T17:56:00.000-04:00w0000t!NOTHING could have made my arrival home bet...w0000t!<BR/><BR/>NOTHING could have made my arrival home better than a fight to death between Level 89 Super Thetan Hubbardians (Bard Class?) and suicidal (rouge class) Ninjews.<BR/><BR/>Three cheers for the ultimate in PGP keys!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com